Seventy-first Session,
7th Meeting (AM)
GA/SPD/612

Fourth Committee Approves 20 Texts for General Assembly Action, Passing 4 by Recorded Vote, 16 by Consensus

Morocco Touts Success of Legislative Polls in Western Sahara, as Algeria Warns against Changing Rules on Territory Set by Security Council

Concluding its consideration of decolonization questions today, the Fourth Committee (Special Political and Decolonization) approved 20 draft resolutions for adoption by the General Assembly, four of them by recorded vote.

Taking up a draft resolution concerning economic and other activities affecting the interests of the peoples of the Non-Self-Governing Territories, the Committee approved it by a recorded vote of 157 in favour to 2 against (Israel, United States), with 2 abstentions (France, United Kingdom).  By the terms of that text, the General Assembly would urge administering Powers to safeguard the inalienable right of the peoples of Non-Self-Governing Territories to their natural resources, and to establish control over the future development of those resources.

The Committee also approved — by a recorded vote of 112 in favour to none against, with 50 abstentions — a draft resolution on implementation of the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples by the specialized agencies and international institutions associated with the United Nations.  By its terms, the General Assembly would urge those and other entities of the United Nations system to provide moral and material assistance, as needed, to the peoples of Non-Self-Governing Territories.

Also requiring a recorded vote was a draft resolution on information from Non-Self-Governing Territories transmitted under Article 73 (e) of the United Nations Charter, which the Committee approved by 156 votes in favour to none against, with 6 abstentions (Central African Republic, France, Guinea-Bissau, Israel, United Kingdom, United States).  By its terms, the General Assembly would request the administering Powers concerned to transmit regularly to the Secretary General statistical and other technical information relating to economic, social and educational conditions in the Territories for which they were respectively responsible.

The Committee also approved – by a recorded 157 votes in favour to 3 against (Israel, United Kingdom, United States), with 2 abstentions (France, Togo) – a text on dissemination of information on decolonization, by which the General Assembly would request that the United Nations take measures to give publicity to its work in the field of decolonization.

Acting without a vote, the Committee approved draft resolutions concerning the questions of American Samoa, Anguilla, Bermuda, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Guam, Montserrat, Pitcairn, Saint Helena, Turks and Caicos Islands and the United States Virgin Islands.  Each of those texts would have the General Assembly reaffirm that it was ultimately for the peoples of the Territories themselves to determine freely their future political status.

By a draft resolution on the question of Western Sahara, approved without a vote, the Assembly would call upon all parties concerned, as well as States of the region, to cooperate with the Secretary-General and his Personal Envoy in efforts to resolve the dispute over that Territory.  It would also welcome the parties’ commitment to work in an atmosphere propitious for dialogue, in order to enter into a more intensive phase of negotiations.

Other draft resolutions approved without a vote today included three texts relating specifically to the Territories of Tokelau, New Caledonia and French Polynesia.  Acting again without a vote, the Committee approved a text on study and training facilities for inhabitants of Non-Self-Governing Territories.

Vladimir Drobnjak (Croatia), Chair of the Fourth Committee, said that draft decisions on the question of Gibraltar and on implementation of the Declaration on the Granting of independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples would be considered at a later date.

Before taking action, the Committee heard from a number of delegations in concluding its general debate.  Algeria’s representative declared:  “While we examine the agenda items sitting comfortably in this room, our duty is not to forget that there are still countries and peoples that bear the trials of foreign occupation and alien domination.”  Regarding the question of Western Sahara, he recalled the recent expulsion of African Union observers and the civilian component of the United Nations Mission for the Referendum in Western Sahara (MINURSO), as well as ceasefire violations in the buffer zone.  “Because of all these worrisome events, the future looms more uncertain,” he said.  Warning against changing rules set by the Security Council and the General Assembly, he emphasized the need to monitor closely the human rights situation and the exploitation of natural resources there until the decolonization process was complete.

Morocco’s representative said that following Western Sahara’s return to its legitimate motherland, that question should be taken off the United Nations agenda.  As witnessed by international observers, the Territory’s citizens had recently participated in democratic national legislative elections in large numbers, and had elected their true representatives to the Moroccan Parliament without incident, he said.  Urging Algeria to act as a principal party to the dispute, he emphasized that Morocco’s autonomy proposal was the only option for reaching a political solution to the dispute, pointing out that the Security Council had recognized his country’s efforts to protect human rights in the Territory, which was not the case in the Algerian camps at Tindouf, where human rights violations occurred every day.

The United Kingdom’s representative said that, should the people of a given Territory choose to remain British, his country would maintain and deepen its special relationship with that Territory.  The 2012 White Paper on Overseas Territories made clear the United Kingdom’s objective to ensure their security and good governance.  At the same time, it expected the territorial governments to meet high standards in maintaining the rule of law and respect for human rights, while delivering efficient public services and building strong communities.

France’s representative said his country continued to cooperate with the United Nations on the question of New Caledonia, and welcomed the steps taken by the Organization’s Committee of Experts in that regard.  France would carry out its mediation role, provide financial assistance and engage with local authorities because it was crucially important to meet the 2018 deadline for the referendum on the Territory’s status, he added.

The Committee also heard from representatives of Uganda, India, Botswana, Gabon, Central African Republic, Benin, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Timor-Leste, Serbia and Sierra Leone.

Speaking in exercise of the right of reply, were representatives of Argentina, Algeria and Morocco.

The Fourth Committee will reconvene at 10 a.m. on Tuesday, 11 October, to begin its consideration of international cooperation in the peaceful uses of outer space.

Statements

RICHARD NDUHUURA (Uganda) said that the people of Western Sahara had patiently waited to gain their independence yet remained under Moroccan occupation.  They were not allowed to exercise their right to self-determination because Morocco had obstructed the referendum process, failing to fulfil its international commitments.  Regrettably, hundreds of Sahrawi lived in exile in Algeria as Morocco continued its systematic violation of human rights and abuse of their natural resources.  Calling attention to the recent violations of the ceasefire agreement between the Frente Popular de Liberación de Saguía el Hamra y Río de Oro (Polisario Front) and Morocco, he said they had seriously impacted security and stability.  Regarding the question of Palestine, Uganda supported a resumption of the peace process, which would require the implementation of a two-State solution, in accordance with the relevant Security Council resolutions.

SURYANARAYAN SRINIVAS PRASAD (India) said the Special Committee on Decolonization was a vehicle striving to complete the decolonization of the remaining 17 Non-Self-Governing Territories.  Since the number of complex challenges involved had increased, it was critical that Member States and the United Nations continue their cooperation at the highest level.  While decolonization and independence were the Special Committee’s main goals, it must also work towards ensuring development for all, he emphasized.

NKOLOI NKOLOI (Botswana) emphasized that the people of Western Sahara had the fundamental human right to determine their own future, yet despite the efforts of the United Nations, they continued to be denied their inalienable right to self-determination and independence.  Encouraging the parties to approach the negotiations in a spirit of tolerance and compromise, he said the will of the Sahrawi people, expressed in a democratic and open process, must be respected by all, and called upon the international community to support the process of results-oriented negotiations until they were free to determine their destiny.  The United Nations Mission for the Referendum in Western Sahara (MINURSO) could only achieve its objectives through if all concerned parties exerted the necessary political will, he stressed.

ANNETTE ANDRÉE ONANGA (Gabon) said it was important to overcome obstacles that had made decolonization efforts ineffective and to further continue promoting economic growth and sustainable development in the Non-Self-Governing Territories.  On the question of Western Sahara, Gabon supported efforts for a lasting, mutually acceptable solution for all parties, in accordance with the relevant United Nations resolutions.  Noting that security threats characterized the regional situation, she said they should impel the international community to breathe new life into negotiations.  Welcoming Morocco’s initiative, she said it provided credible and reassuring prospects for a final agreement.  Gabon recognized all political and social initiatives launched and called upon all in the region to pool their efforts to minimize destabilization resulting from terrorist activities, which undermined the Sahel-Sahara region.

LARRY MARCEL KOYMA (Central African Republic), noting that a settlement of the situation in Western Sahara had been at an impasse for 40 years due to the positions of certain parties, said the political solution prescribed by the Security Council should be favoured because it was realistic.  The historical context had established the “Moroccan-ness” of Western Sahara and Morocco had made significant economic investments in the Territory, he said, adding that people native to it had been placed at the head of local institutions.  He welcomed Morocco’s efforts, pointing out that the Security Council had qualified them as serious and credible.  The autonomy proposal demonstrated a spirit of realism and compromise, he said, emphasizing that the objective position of the Central African Republic on the matter did not affect its friendly relations with Algeria.

JEAN CLAUDE DO REGO (Benin), addressing the question of Western Sahara, said Morocco’s initiative could provide a basis for credible negotiations and resolve the dispute over the Territory.  Welcoming Morocco’s decision to rejoin the African Union, he emphasized that, as a founding member of the bloc, it aimed to reinforce its relations with other African countries.  Among other things, he emphasized the need for the international community to focus its efforts on combating poverty and supporting development on the continent.

ALBERTINA MACDONALD (Mozambique) said that despite all efforts undertaken in the last 40 years, Western Sahara remained on the list of Non-Self-Governing Territories.  Concrete action was required to ensure that its people exercise their right to self-determination.  Mozambique supported international efforts for a mutually acceptable political solution, he said, adding that urgent action must be taken to set a date for the self-determination referendum and to ensure that the people of Western Sahara enjoyed their economic, social and cultural rights.  Among other things, she emphasized that the United Nations Mission for the Referendum in Western Sahara (MINURSO) must be provided with a civilian component, adequate financial resources and a human rights mandate.

FREDERICK M. SHAVA (Zimbabwe), associating himself with the Non-Aligned Movement, recalled that the African Union Assembly had called upon the General Assembly to determine a date for holding a self-determination referendum in Western Sahara.  Resolving the situation in that Territory was a prerequisite for peace, security and stability in Africa.  Negotiations between Morocco and Polisario would be essential to moving forward the process leading up to the referendum, he said.  Through negotiations, the two parties had agreed on the Settlement Plan in 1988, but that had been derailed by one party’s obstructions, he recalled.  The Security Council had extended MINURSO’s mandate several times, demonstrating its resolve to hold the long-overdue referendum.  Zimbabwe supported the Committee’s approval of a draft resolution that would underline the principles of self-determination and decolonization, and looked forward to its implementation, he said.

EMANUEL TILMAN (Timor-Leste), associating himself with the Non-Aligned Movement, said his own country had once been the subject of decolonization deliberations in the Committee, which had played an important role in his people’s attainment of self-determination.  The Timorese people had argued for their rights in the halls of the United Nations, much as the present-day petitioners were doing in the Committee.  Timor-Leste shared much with Western Sahara in terms of historical context, past human rights violations and as the subjects of United Nations resolutions on the right to self-determination.  Continued negotiations between Morocco and Polisario under United Nations auspices, in good faith and without conditions, would result in a solution, he said recommending that a date be set for such talks.  Timor-Leste continued to support the role of MINURSO and the good offices of the Secretary-General in the pursuit of a comprehensive and just solution.

ZORAN VUJIC (Serbia) said Gibraltar was registered as a Non-Self-Governing Territory and was therefore subject to decolonization.  General Assembly resolution 2070 (XX) indicated that the question of Gibraltar should be resolved through bilateral negotiations, and only the United Nations could decide when a particular decolonization process was complete, he emphasized.  The process could only conclude through dialogue between States, because that was the only way to reach a sustainable and lasting agreement, he said, adding that Serbia supported Spain’s proposal, believing it would benefit all parties.

ADIKALIE F. SUMAH (Sierra Leone) said prospects for attaining the goals set out in the Plan of Action for the Third International Decade for the Eradication of Colonialism were not encouraging.  As such, the administering Powers and the Special Committee must work closely together in an atmosphere of mutual trust and respect, engaging with a view to identifying activities that were achievable and those requiring further involvement.  Commending the Government of New Zealand’s exemplary support for the people of Tokelau, he welcomed the effort by the Government of France to improve access for the indigenous people of New Caledonia to economic and social benefits.  Nevertheless, greater efforts were needed in the area of higher professional education in order to set indigenous people on a better footing in the domain of governance, he emphasized.

STEPHEN HICKEY (United Kingdom) said his Government’s relationship with its Overseas Territories was a modern one based on partnership, shared values and the right of their peoples to choose whether to remain British.  Where the people of a Territory chose to remain British, the United Kingdom would maintain and deepen its special relationship with that Territory, he said, adding that in such cases, both parties recognized that the relationship brought mutual benefits and responsibilities.  Noting that the 2012 White Paper on Overseas Territories published by the Government of the United Kingdom Government made clear the country’s fundamental objective to ensure the security and good governance of the Territories and their peoples, he said that responsibility flowed from international law, including the Charter of the United Nations.  At the same time, the United Kingdom expected territorial governments to meet the same high standards as the Government of the United Kingdom in maintaining the rule of law and respect for human rights, while delivering efficient public services and building strong communities.

Mr. BUHLER (France) said his country continued to cooperate with the United Nations on the question of New Caledonia, and had communicated with the Secretariat’s Decolonization Unit on updating the working document, in accordance with the United Nations Charter.  France also welcomed the fact that the United Nations Committee of Experts had observed and reviewed the electoral process, noting that 15 experts had been available to consult with the authorities.  Despite those positive developments, however, some improvements could be made in the functioning of the Committee, he said.  France would carry out its mediator role, provide financial assistance, and engage with local authorities because it was crucial to meet the 2018 deadline for the status referendum.

SABRI BOUKADOUM (Algeria) said Africa’s liberators had shed their blood to oppose conquerors who had come from faraway shores to subjugate others in their own lands, deplete their resources and reduce them to servitude.  “Is that legacy and indomitable spirit undeserved in our hands?” he asked, voicing regret that the inheritors had simply not completed the process of decolonization.  “While we examine the agenda items sitting comfortably in this room, our duty is not to forget that there are still countries and peoples that bear the trials of foreign occupation and alien domination,” he said, emphasizing that his own country would never give up the battle subjugation.

Turning to the situation in Western Sahara, he said the dispute could only be resolved through the Sahrawi people’s full, free and fair exercise of their alienable right to self-determination.  Recalling the expulsion of African Union observers and MINURSO’s civilian component, as well as ceasefire violations in the buffer zone, he said the international community was facing the same attempts to hijack the peace process.  “Because of all these worrisome events, the future looms more uncertain,” he said, emphasizing that those pouring oil over a burning furnace were forgetting that the idea of a referendum had been a compromise, precisely negotiated and accepted by the two parties to the conflict.

While the question of Western Sahara was an African one, Algeria stood ready to contribute to efforts by international organizations, he said, emphasizing that no one had the right to change rules set by the Security Council and the General Assembly.  Expressing concern about the risks of terrorism, drug trafficking and transnational organized crime in the region, he said:  “Let us start by what Security Council resolution has asked for, the fifth round of negotiations between the two parties.”  Among other things, the human rights situation in the Territory and the exploitation of its natural resources must be watched closely until the question of Western Sahara’s decolonization was resolved, he stressed.

OMAR HILALE (Morocco) said it was an undeniable fact that his country had regained its southern provinces in accordance with the Madrid Agreement, adding that, following Western Sahara’s return to its legitimate motherland, the matter should be taken off the United Nations agenda.  Morocco faced hostility from Algeria, which had placed North Africa in a hegemonic vice and continued to wage “a sort of cold war”.  Recalling that paragraph 6 of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) described any attempt to partially or fully destroy national or territorial unity as incompatible with the Charter, he said it also stated that while the Security Council was exercising its functions on a particular issue, the General Assembly must not pass any resolution on the same matter unless the Council requested that it do so.  The committee should, therefore, have ceased to examine the question of Western Sahara in 1988, when it had been passed on to the Security Council.  However, the matter continued to be examined by the Security Council and the Committee, in violation of the Charter, he said.

Urging the General Assembly to respect the Charter and the responsibilities of the Council, he went on to recall that the Council had taken up Western Sahara as a dispute under Chapter Six of the Charter, and emphasized that none of its 63 resolutions qualified it as a decolonization matter.  The Secretary-General had also never presented the issue from that perspective.  Stressing that the Territory had always been Moroccan and always would be, he said its citizens had recently participated in democratic and transparent national legislative elections in large numbers and elected their true representatives to the Moroccan Parliament without incident, as witnessed by international observers.  Morocco had also recently dedicated an $8 billion budget to the Territory’s development.  In 2007, Morocco had proposed a solution to overcome the impasse over the Territory, under the auspices of the Security Council, which had qualified it as serious and credible in 11 of its resolutions.

Rather than making use of that historic opportunity, however, other parties had chosen to remain attached to the status quo, he continued, urging Algeria to assume its responsibilities and act as a principal party to the dispute and stressing that it could no longer hide behind the pretence of being simply an observer State.  Morocco’s autonomy proposal was the only option for reaching a political solution to the dispute, he emphasized, pointing out that the Security Council had recognized his country’s efforts to protect human rights in the Territory, which was not the case in the Tindouf camps in Algeria, where human rights violations occurred every day.  Reports by the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, World Food Programme, and other entities confirmed that Polisario leaders had been diverting humanitarian assistance from the camps, and had recently also confirmed that Algeria was collecting value-added tax on aid.  He asked how a State could collect taxes that would further exacerbate suffering in the camps, in flagrant violation of the Geneva Convention.

Right of Reply

The representative of Argentina, speaking in exercise of the right of reply, recalled that the Malvinas[1], South Georgia Islands and South Sandwich Islands as well as the surrounding maritime areas were an integral part of his country’s territory.  The United Kingdom’s illegal occupation had led the General Assembly to adopt a number of related resolutions and was the subject of discussions calling upon the two parties to find a solution to the dispute.  Emphasizing the Government of Argentina’s rejection of any reference to the White Paper and any unilateral action by the United Kingdom, he also reiterated that the principle of self-determination was entirely inapplicable to the question of the Malvinas, which was a special and particular case of sovereignty.

The representative of Algeria recalled relevant Security Council resolutions on the question of Western Sahara, saying they demanded the immediate withdrawal of Moroccan troops.  “Why does Morocco not grant access to fact-finding mission?” he asked.  “If all the Sahrawi in Western Sahara are very happy, what is wrong with the referendum?”

The representative of Morocco responded by recalling that in 2001, then-Secretary-General Kofi Annan had said that a referendum was inapplicable, adding that since 2003, the Security Council did not use the term “referendum” any more.  Furthermore, the September 2015 legislative elections had been conducted in a smooth fashion, and Western Sahara was living in democracy.  “We don’t want drama,” he said, pointing out that Algeria had rejected the Secretary-General’s proposal in 2011.

The representative of Algeria said with regard to the autonomy initiative that the Secretary-General had stated on 4 November 2015 that it was no longer valid, and that such an initiative would have to emerge from negotiations between the two parties involved — Morocco and the Polisario Front — as stated by the Security Council.  He urged Morocco to speak with Polisario, emphasizing that his country wished to build the future and that a solution for everyone must involve Morocco sitting down with Polisario.

The representative of Morocco emphasized the inapplicability of a referendum to Western Sahara, as recognized in the Secretary-General’s report, recalling that former Personal Envoy James Baker’s plan had been accepted but had been impossible to implement due to Algeria’s veto.  While conceding that Polisario was a participant, he stressed that Algeria was responsible for events in Tindouf.  Lacking the freedom to make decisions or negotiate, Polisario was a mere policy instrument, he said, adding that Algeria was responsible, and must be part of any solution.

Action on Draft Resolutions

The Committee first took up draft resolution I – on information from Non‑Self‑Governing Territories transmitted under Article 73 (e) of the Charter of the United Nations – approving it by a recorded vote of 156 in favour to none against, with 6 abstentions (Central African Republic, France, Guinea-Bissau, Israel, United Kingdom, United States).

The representative of the United Kingdom, speaking in explanation of position, said he had abstained from voting because the decision of a Non-Self-Governing Territory to leave the administering Power was ultimately one for that Territory and the administering Power, and not the General Assembly.

Taking up draft resolution IV on Economic and other activities which affect the interests of the peoples of the Non-Self-Governing Territories, the Committee approved it by a recorded vote of 157 in favour to 2 against (Israel, United States), with 2 abstentions (France, United Kingdom).

The representative of Argentina, speaking in explanation of position, said the text’s applicability depended upon the right to self‑determination, which required an active subject.  It was inapplicable to the question of the Malvinas, which was a sovereignty dispute between Argentina and the United Kingdom.  Furthermore, the United Kingdom’s exploration for renewable and non-renewable resources was in open contravention of United Nations’ resolutions.

The Committee then took up the draft resolution Implementation of the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples by the specialized agencies and the international institutions associated with the United Nations (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.48), approving it by a recorded 112 votes in favour to none against, with 50 abstentions.

The representative of the United Kingdom, speaking in explanation of position, reaffirmed his country’s support for the specialized agencies, while emphasizing that their statutes must be carefully respected.  The United Kingdom had therefore abstained from the vote.

The representative of Argentina said that the draft resolution must be implemented in accordance with the relevant resolutions of the Security Council, General Assembly, and the Special Committee on Decolonization.

Taking up the draft resolution Offers by Member States of study and training facilities for inhabitants of Non-Self-Governing Territories (document A/C.4/71/L.3), the Committee approved it without a vote.

GUILLAUME DABOUIS, European Union, said his delegation looked forward to the consensual adoption of the draft resolution on Western Sahara, and encouraged support for efforts by the Secretary-General’s Personal Envoy in consultations with the parties and neighbouring States.  Welcoming the adoption of Security Council resolution 2285 (2016), he encouraged the parties to continue to demonstrate political will in order to begin a more intensive phase of negotiations, in good faith and without preconditions.  The European Union supported the methodology of “shuttle diplomacy” proposed by the Personal Envoy and accepted by the parties, he added.

The representative of the United Kingdom said his country had joined the consensus on draft resolutions relating to agenda item 58 (on implementation of the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples), reflecting its full support for self-determination, but regretted that the Special Committee on Decolonization maintained its outdated approach, including its failure to recognize the modernization of the United Kingdom’s relationship with its Overseas Territories.  They had internal governments and had chosen freely to continue their relationships with the United Kingdom, he said, pointing out that the draft resolutions did not reflect that modern relationship, which was based on partnership, shared values and self-determination.

Turning to action, the Committee took up the following draft resolutions:  Question of Western Sahara (document A/C.4/71/L.4*); Question of Tokelau (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.60); Question of American Samoa (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.63); Question of Anguilla (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.68); Question of Bermuda (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.73); Question of the British Virgin Islands (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.77); Question of the Cayman Islands (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.81); Question of Guam (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.91); Question of Montserrat (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.91); Question of Pitcairn (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.95); Question of Saint Helena (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.99); Question of the Turks and Caicos Islands (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.104), Question of the United States Virgin Islands (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.109); Question of New Caledonia (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.114); and Question of French Polynesia (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.120).

It approved all those texts without a vote.

Taking up the draft resolution on Dissemination of Information on Decolonization (document A/71/23, chapter XIII, p.46), the Committee approved it by a recorded vote of 157 in favour to 3 against (Israel, United Kingdom, United States), with 2 abstentions (France, Togo).

The representative of the United Kingdom, speaking in explanation of position, said the obligation that the text placed on the Secretariat represented an unwarranted drain on United Nations resources and was unacceptable to his delegation.

The representative of Argentina expressed his delegation’s firm support for self-determination for people under colonial occupation, saying the text just approved must be implemented as per the relevant resolutions.  In terms of General Assembly resolution 2265 (XXV), the matter regarding the Malvinas, South Georgia Islands and South Sandwich Islands as well as the surrounding maritime areas was a sovereignty dispute, he said, adding that it could be resolved by resuming bilateral negotiations.

The representative of Venezuela, speaking on behalf of the Special Committee on Decolonization, pointed out that 11 of the draft resolutions previously contained in the so-called “omnibus” text were now disaggregated, and there was now a specific text for each Territory.

[1] A dispute exists between the Governments of Argentina and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland concerning sovereignty over the Falkland Islands (Malvinas).

For information media. Not an official record.